Corporate Strategy Crew Confessions

Speaker 1 0:00

Under my jacket . Yeah , I couldn't hear you because Craig John , well , I couldn't hear you .

Speaker 2 0:06

Underneath my work clothes , I always have corporate strategy swag on Always .

Speaker 1 0:13

Always .

Speaker 2 0:14

Yeah , that way like , if you have x-ray vision and you're watching my work videos . You know that I'm a member of the corporate strategy crew .

Speaker 1 0:20

Do you have a tattoo like I do ?

Speaker 2 0:22

Yeah , I do , I just can't show it . Yeah , you can't show mine . It's in a very delicate place . I agree , we actually got them Bottom of my feet .

Speaker 1 0:35

There's been too much talk about feet on this podcast , too much it needs to stop .

Speaker 2 0:40

You know what we haven't talked about in forever .

Speaker 1 0:42

Oh , no , forever .

Speaker 2 0:45

Like it makes me sad we haven't talked about in forever , oh no , forever . Like it makes me sad we haven't talked about it in so long , don't ?

Speaker 1 0:54

I want you to know that , at least for me , the audio cut out .

Speaker 2 0:58

Oh good , it probably cut out for everybody . I sang the theme song to Pepsi man .

Speaker 1 1:08

Pepsi man out for everybody . Uh , I sang the theme song . Do pepsi man , pepsi man . Every single person on discord has been begging for pepsi man to come back .

Speaker 2 1:12

you know that , I know they have . I've seen it at bruce where pepsi , where man at clark , pepsi man win at craig pepsi man , man , pepsi man , how Pepsi man who P-E-P-S-I man ?

Speaker 1 1:30

P-E-P-S-I man , pepsi man , oh , I miss him . I miss him already I do too .

Speaker 2 1:40

It's been too long . It's been way too long .

Speaker 1 1:43

So we're back here again . How's your week going ? How ?

Speaker 2 1:46

was your week . Oh , my week has been going . Welcome back to corporate strategy podcast , to come in email . I'm bruce , I'm , uh , it's been a long one . It's been a long one for sure , yeah , yeah , yeah , this has been one of those weeks where , um , what to say without incriminating myself or potentially becoming an HR risk , uh , like I , I , I think about and I weigh the options of if I just quit , how long could I be poor ?

Speaker 1 2:23

for you know , like I think I'd feel better if I was poor , that's , that's I want to put an asterisk by what you just said , because you're not incriminating yourself to hr , you're just saying in general I think everybody thinks about this , no matter what company you work for it's like what if I just didn't work ?

Speaker 2 2:42

yeah , yeah . What if I said I resign , I'll give you two weeks because I'm a good guy From any company .

Speaker 1 2:48

This is not just my company .

Speaker 2 2:48

I'm the kind of person that'll give you two weeks . I just resign and I'm not going to work for a bit . I need to hate not working before I get back to it . Does that sound okay ? I need to never come back .

Speaker 2 3:05

I told you this beforehand but I didn't tell our dear listeners . I spent three hours today setting up my office to do some video recordings on this ransomware sort of paper I've built . So I'm going to basically take the paper . The paper's like 20 pages long . I've turned it into seven scripts . I've loaded the scripts up into my prompter . I have my prompter pages long . I've turned

Video Recording Nightmare

Speaker 2 3:25

it into seven scripts . I've loaded the scripts up into my prompter .

Speaker 2 3:25

I have my prompter set up . I have lights set up , my mic set up , had my jacket on everything and I record for literally two and a half hours and when I start watching the playback and it's not even like a rookie mistake , because when I did my test recordings they looked good , they sounded good . The problem was I didn't do a test recording where I was reading from the prompter , I just did test recordings where I was talking and the the recordings I was reading from the prompter . For whatever reason , my eyes are looking up and not directly at the camera , which is weird because they were looking like . The prompter line is adjacent with the lens of the camera and I don't know what light , physical , magic funkery is occurring here . But looking at the lens does not mean I'm looking at the lens , if you know what I'm saying .

Speaker 1 4:16

So I lost two and a half hours today of my only free time .

Speaker 2 4:19

I had this week to get this thing done and now I'm like when am I gonna actually do this work , because I have no time to do it next week that's terrible look at it's terrible look at it for me , let me .

Speaker 1 4:28

Let me take a look at you .

Speaker 2 4:29

Oh yeah , you're looking a foot above my head you look like you look like you have some sort of floating eye problem where , like , you're looking at me but not looking at me like the camera is right there I'm pointing my finger at , like this great radio because everyone can't see anything that I'm saying . But like I want you to imagine you're watching , you know , like Stephen Colbert on TV , but his eyes are like 45 degree angle away from the camera , upward . That's what it looks like . It makes it makes me look dead , like I look like I'm a zombie , like dead eye I I don't fun , I fundamentally don't understand .

Speaker 2 5:05

So I went to my video guy , my teammate , and I was like dude , what the heck ? Like I just spent two hours doing this . And then I like he's like , okay , let's try some test recordings . And like we go , we just start doing . And he's like I , I've worked in video my whole life , I have no idea what's going on . Like no , this is weird . So then I started like googling even further . Just like what the heck ? Looking at lens but not . But like eyes not focused on lens . And apparently this happens with the freaking iphone cameras .

Speaker 2 5:33

So people , will like set up their cameras on the tripod and if you look down the lens it doesn't look like you're looking at it . You have to look like above the lens in the case of the iphone to sit like and I'm just , I'm at a loss . I wasted so much time , I'm out of energy , I'm out of Fs to give . This has been a cap on a week of just exhausting for Bruce . I want to quit . Today I was like I could resign , I could quit my job and that would be fine . I'll just live off of beans and cornbread and I think I can do it . I think I can do it .

Speaker 1 6:06

Are you ? How are you ? Well , you know , I commiserate with you . Mine wasn't as bad , but that sucks . That you did two hours and then you like watch it and you're like what in the actual like ? You just were like there's no way , it's all like this , right , and you probably like I'm imagining you scrubbing the video being like no , is it all this way ?

Speaker 2 6:26

No , no , no , please , please no no .

Speaker 1 6:29

And then you get to the end and you're like , yep , the whole thing is me just looking like a zombie .

Speaker 2 6:37

This is why you have to have a video producer Like truly it's , even if you someone who's watching you , because it you just you can't self-direct unless that's an ai product that needs to happen you need like an ai director . Nvidia actually has a feature . I don't know . I don't know what program like it works with , but nvidia has a feature that uses ai to make your eyes always looking at the camera so like if I'm reading my email over here , it looks like I'm still looking at you , like that's a cool feature .

Speaker 1 7:07

That's kind of terrifying . I'm not going to lie , it is .

Speaker 2 7:09

Yeah , yeah , but I could have used it today .

Speaker 1 7:13

I could have used it . I mean , like , honestly , that's a very helpful . It's like I'm by myself . I need an AI producer .

Speaker 2 7:29

I'm not this like having something that gives you that real-time on-screen feedback . That should be a product . Someone figure it out . Here's the problem , I mean I mean here's

Carrying More Weight

Speaker 2 7:33

. Here's .

Speaker 2 7:33

The ultimate problem with all of this is and this , I mean this we talked about in shitification , but I think this is this needs another , this . There's needs to be another word for this specific thing where it's you're capable , go do it yourself . We don't need a producer . We don't need a director . We don't need a film crew . We don't need do it yourself in your office at home . Go buy your expensive equipment .

Speaker 2 7:54

Oh , I realize your job is just writing and creating marketing material , but now you have to become a video expert as part of your job and you need to understand sight lines and green screens and chroma keys and lighting and audio . That's not your job , but it is now . I hope you don't mind that we're just adding this workload to you because we're too cheap to hire someone to do it or we don't have time . I do think the larger problem and I feel this not just in video , I feel this across everything is that businesses I work in a startup so I kind of volunteered for this , but I think this is true more broadly . Businesses just expect everyone to carry more weight . I don't care how strong you are , I don't care how weak you are , you will carry more weight .

Speaker 1 8:41

A hundred percent agree with you . It's something that's been happening a lot for us as we plan for next year . We're already busting at the seams . Our team is just overloaded left and right . We're trying our best to manage it , trying our best to prioritize , and we're getting this top-down direction to go faster . And it's just blowing our minds because we're like it's not possible to go faster with the amount of resources we have , like there has to be a . No , we're not doing anything else . Focus on these couple of things and that's it . But to your point , it's like our roles and the expectations for our roles continue to grow and I don't know if it's like a . Oh , it's just this small thing , bruce . All you got to do is just mount your iphone up there . Look into the iphone . That's it . That's all you got . That's not hard . Mount your iPhone up there , look into the iPhone . That's it . That's all you got . That's not hard .

Speaker 2 9:28

That's all I got to do .

Speaker 1 9:29

You already wrote the white paper . Just read the 20-page white paper into the camera . That's not difficult . Why not Just put it in a file for us and make it look good so we can watch it and present it on our website ? That doesn't seem hard . That'll take you what Like an hour 20 minutes 20 minutes at most . It's like has this happened incrementally ? Is this a very incremental ?

Speaker 2 9:54

thing that's happened to us . Did you ever read what was it ? It's not the Scarlet Letter , it was the Crucible , crucible .

Speaker 1 10:00

Arthur Miller , with the witches , oh , I did .

Speaker 2 10:04

Was it Goody Proctor ? I forget his name . Do you remember the one guy who they think is a witch ? And they put him in the pit and they just start putting stones on his body ? And you know , he's just like . I am so tired of these buffoons and their witchery , but they think I'm a witch . So you know what I'm going to say to them . I'm just going to say more weight . And then they crush him by putting stones on his body and he dies that way , which is a real thing . That happened to people . But I mean , like it is pretty epic that he was like more weight . I feel like that's us , I feel like that is us right . And when I say us , I don't mean Clark and Bruce , I mean collective , the corporate fam and everyone in corporate . There is just this additive weight that keeps happening .

Speaker 2 10:47

And what you said is actually what I think we need to diagnose on today's episode as our impromptu topic . When you are

High Capacity Workers

Speaker 2 10:55

asked to do more faster , does that actually make it so ? Because in my , in this man's humble opinion , when someone says , hey , I need you to do this too , or like , can you prioritize this , and then I drop everything else in priority , I feel like . What actually ends up happening is the context switching plus the . Just the general frazzledness of my very fragile nature makes me a lot slower .

Speaker 2 11:22

And had they just waited and were patient and said we're going to add this to the bottom of the stack , get to it when you can , I feel like the quality would have been better and I probably would have got it done faster . But because we need this right now , go , go , go , go go . What's going to end up happening is it's not going to get done as fast as it actually could . I'm going to become clinically depressed and want to quit my job . Also , a good indicator of how I feel is , when I walk away from my desk , how deep the sighs are , and this week the sighs are deep . Let me tell you I'm just right , like it's momentous . Do you agree with that assessment ?

Speaker 1 12:00

I do . But I have a question for you . You would consider yourself a high-capacity worker , right ? You can take on a lot . Would you consider yourself a high-capacity worker ? Right , you can take on a lot . Would you consider yourself that when you ? Look across your peers , your peers , your team . You're like I take on a lot .

Speaker 2 12:13

It's not even close . It's not even close and I don't think any of my team would disagree . They're asking can I help you ? And I'm like I wish that you could .

Speaker 1 12:23

I really do , but you know , it's interesting Play this mind game out with me , all right , I love mind games Go your high capacity .

Speaker 1 12:37

I'm high capacity . When I ask my team to take on more , what I often find is they don't know how to do it efficiently , and the way I do it is different than how they do it . And then , when I kind of get into it , I'm like why is it taking them so long to do this ? And I'm like , hey , you know , maybe I have some tips of how you could actually do this really quick . Like do you want to sit together and do it ?

Speaker 1 12:59

I show them something that blows their minds and they're like holy cow , like that was actually great , like like now I understand how you do this so quick . I'm like , yeah , you know , you just gotta have the right system , you gotta use the right tool . You know , whatever , whatever the , the hack is in that scenario . Some things are not and all things are not equal , but that's what I've noticed a little bit . So do the people above us that ask us to do more and they're just , oh , yeah , just take on video recording and producing and screen reading , like you got that ? Do they know something you don't ?

Speaker 2 13:26

No , okay , well , that was a fun mind game . I really appreciate playing that .

Speaker 1 13:34

Thanks , Clark , I do this with myself because I'm like , okay , well , if I ask my team to do something and they don't know how to do it fast or good enough , and then I sit with them , I kind of show them and I'm like , okay , now they get it , like now I'm seeing the faster output , it makes me think people above me that think that things can be done fast Do they know something I don't know ?

Speaker 2 13:56

So , in my org specifically , I can't do what my boss does , my boss can't do what I can do , and my team can't do what I do and I can't do what they can do , if that makes sense . So no one is capable of doing the things that either their upper or subsequent person does , which leaves you very much in a . The only way to really fix this problem is to add more repeat skills to the mix . Like we're , we're very well diversitized in a skill portfolio , but we have no redundancy on the team at all . I have one teammate that I would say is redundant and she's phenomenal , and the one thing I don't want to do is have her in the same situation where I am Basically like oh , you get to go do this now . I hope you don't jump off a cliff today , today , uh , you know like I want to be protective of the workload and the bandwidth and the weight that I would send down to her . So I I don't uh that .

Speaker 1 15:13

That means I do carry more , you know , it's just uh yeah , it is interesting the two perspectives of you're in a startup well , you said , makes sense . It's like your team isn't big enough and your company isn't at the size to have specialized skill sets Right , like you kind of own a general domain of things or a vertical of things in your portfolio and you guys are responsible for that function in its entirety . For me it's like I am very , very specialized into product management so the redundancy is high because it's we're built because of the scale that we have to operate . If someone's out , someone just steps in Right .

Speaker 2 15:55

You have a team of product managers .

Speaker 1 15:57

Yeah , I have a team of product managers who has a team of product owners on their team and so , like if someone's out like I could theoretically step in and do their job because I have the same skillset and capability . I don't think it always goes the other way , like I think the upwards trajectory is like they probably can't do some of the things that I do because they don't have the context , they don't have the experience or they haven't been in all these situations . So again experience . So like been in all these situations , again experience . So like it doesn't really work both ways , but it certainly works that I can . I could step in and help my team if they needed me to . Yours is totally different .

Speaker 2 16:35

I think that's good , though . I think that's normal and that should be expected , right Like , in order to get to the next level , I feel like you have to be able to do the previous level . That's how it should be . I know that's not how it is , but that's how it should be . And you know , at a startup you don't hire that way , right Like , I'm hiring , I have a need and I need a hire to fill that need . The reason that need exists is because no one at the startup can do that job . So I'm very cognizant , like I am in a different position and a lot of my frustrations and complaints are just because it is startup and it is exhausting . And I am , unfortunately , very talented and very diverse in my skill set , which , like seems great on paper , but then you realize , like , what it means as far as expectations , capacity and outcome , and it's just a maddening , frustrating experience . It's just exhausting at the end of the day . But to come back to my main thought , I still feel like the expectation is more than it used to be , and that's not just startup . I do feel like the expectation is more , do faster , do more , better quality Cause you cause .

Speaker 2 17:49

I think businesses in general , are just competing a lot harder than they used to . We're in a , we're in a bad market right now , right , like we talked about the jobs report last week Not a lot of them . When there's less jobs , there's less spending . When there's less spending , there's less income and profit for companies . So companies become a lot more brutal , a lot more cutthroat .

Speaker 2 18:07

I got to , I got to beat my competitor because every sale is either life or death for the company . Like it's . It's very like violent language , I mean , like you know , you think about it , but it is like businesses become almost like violent in the way that I have to outperform them because they or us won't be here in two years , right , and I think that that mentality that sort of it is almost war-esque is being pushed down to us and we're essentially soldiers in this fight now , and every battle you lose is a potential . Now , uh , and every battle you lose is a potential , you know , achilles heel for the company , I don't know it just like it feels oppressive . It feels very , very oppressive right now and I don't think it's going to get better yeah , you know this , this topic is really timely , I you know .

Speaker 1 19:00

Let me tell you a story . Let's sit down together , let's tell a . Tell a story .

Speaker 2 19:05

Sorry , I've been seated this whole time .

Speaker 1 19:07

Oh , have you been ? Oh , I've been standing .

Speaker 2 19:09

Sorry .

Speaker 1 19:09

You

The Power of Saying No

Speaker 1 19:10

should probably think about if you should stand or not . You don't have to , but think about it . All right . Okay , we're together . I don't like that swivel . Nobody can see what you're doing right now , but I don't like it . Okay , I'm going to set a story for you .

Speaker 2 19:24

Okay , so last year , 24 , a good year yeah 2024 .

Speaker 1 19:32

It was a good year . I had a employee that's one of my manager's employees , but I know them well . I had them come to us and say , hey , I want more opportunity , I want to take on more , I want to show that I'm ready , kind of , for that next level . So he said , okay , great , you know there's . We're always looking for opportunities to kind of like stretch a new skill set or learn or be able to step into something that's higher capacity or more strategic or whatever it is . So we gave this person additional responsibility this year to say , okay , well , let's see how to handle it .

Speaker 1 20:04

We'll give them a little more responsibility . And in the beginning of the year they had some personal stuff go on and so like that was totally understandable , like hey , no worries , we're going to figure this out together . And lately it's actually gotten to the point where this person is just struggling . They can't keep up with the workload and we're at the point where it's like it's almost time to take the responsibility away from them . Or , if they want to keep it , it's almost like performance discussion time , because it's starting to impact many teams . And they said they could do it . They haven't expressed concerns around doing it , but we constantly see the indicators that they're not performing over and over and over again . And so I sat down with them this week as a skip level management meeting and I was just like hey , I'm concerned just about your performance . You know we wanted to stretch you this year , but we're just not seeing you being able to have the capacity to do it .

Speaker 1 20:55

And they looked at me and they said I have 10 spinning plates right now and they're like every day I feel like a new plate is coming into the mix and I'm like I'm about to drop one of the plates and they're like I can't keep up . I'm working a ton . You know I'm taking on more and more and more , and as I kind of sat with them and kind of heard what was going on , it made me think about the power of no . And what I told this person is like you can't be afraid to say no . You've got I mean , especially in product management like prioritization is everything . Not everything can be a top priority . You've got to be able to prioritize what are the most important spinning plates and say no to other things . And when people come to you telling you to do something else , don't just take it in , say like , okay , you know I don't think that fits in my priorities , but if you think it does , here's my top 10 . You know , do you think I should drop one of those so I can take this on too ? Like the power of offering trade-offs , to say I can take that on , but something else needs to give , and so I basically you can take that on , but something else needs to give . And so I basically you know , pretty directly asked the person I was like next week , I want to know what four things are you dropping from those 10 right now ? Like you need to drop it next week immediately . Like , give us a recommendation of your top four things you're getting rid of on your plate , because in reality , not all of those , even though I wish they could be can be the top priority .

Speaker 1 22:12

And I think that goes back to your sentiment of like , how do you kind of combat this ? How do you handle this situation ? And when you're early in your career , like saying yes to things is good , you should be accepting more opportunities , should be looking for more opportunity , but you need to make sure you under commit and over deliver on that opportunity and be realistic . When your plate becomes heavy or you get too many plates balancing or spinning in motion , you've got to say bruce , so happy you brought this , uh , this new project to my attention . You know I'd love to take this on .

Speaker 1 22:43

Frankly , I just don't think I have the bandwidth . You know , here's my project list and I don't think this is more important than anything here . But if you'd like me to drop one of these , I can do that and and I can pick this up . Just let me know which one you want me to drop , and so I feel like that's maybe the conversation that we need to remember can happen . It's not just yes , yes , yes , more , more , more . I'm just going to do it . It's like no , actually , just list out the things that you're doing that's taking up the majority of your time and tell them which thing do you want me to get rid of ? So I can do this and just leave it up to the person asking you .

Speaker 2 23:14

You know what's so funny . I love this . I did 50% of this this week . Yeah , you got asked to do something . Yeah well , it's not good , I'll tell you , because the 50% is the problem . We got asked to do something that literally no one on my team had bandwidth for or could do . So I said we have no bandwidth , In fact , we're all over capacity , and they're like , oh well , it needs to get done . I'm like I agree . So I guess I'll just do it then , and that was the problem .

Speaker 1 23:48

That's a critical mistake you made there . You got to rewind that conversation and be like what's coming off ?

Speaker 2 23:54

Nothing because everything else is already in play and due in the next two weeks . So that's the problem , right Is there is there is no coming off the priority list and we're not going to not do this thing because it costs us $20,000 . So we have to do it and we have to get it done in time . Like it's just there . I would love to be able to negotiate priorities and maybe that's my next step is , like really starting to keep a list of like . Here's our priorities , here's our list , what's coming off , what's going in . But unfortunately , because we're so lean and because we are so focused on all value all the time I don , we're so lean and because we are so focused on all value all the time , I don't know . I don't know if there's any negotiation to be had . It's the only negotiation is how many extra hours are you working this week for no actual reward or satisfaction .

Speaker 1 24:44

Uh , yeah , I always tell my team and you're to your point . I mean , you're in a startup , so like , in that case , yeah , that's tough , like everything's a priority fires can happen every day and in my case that's tough , like everything's a priority Fires can happen every day , and in my case it's like it's totally and I think most people who work at traditional corporate sense totally in your realm to control your priorities and offer those trade-offs .

Speaker 1 25:04

So you're not just saying no , no , no , all the time .

Speaker 1 25:05

You're saying you know , maybe there's an opportunity to take this on , but here's all everything on my list , Like what can I deprioritize and the three levers that I think are important . Maybe the best tip I can share maybe not in your scenario , but maybe in

Time, Scope, Resources Tradeoffs

Speaker 1 25:18

your scenario time , scope , resources . So can I extend the time ? Can I have a little more time for this project ? Like , instead of next Monday , can it be the following , so I can get it done by beginning of October ? Like that's an option .

Speaker 1 25:31

If that's not an option , it's like okay , can we reduce the scope of this ? Can I cut the scope of this by 10% , 20% . Remove this page , remove that part of the project , remove this feature , whatever it is , and that way I think we can still get it done on time . And on budget or resources , Can I have more money ? Can I hire somebody ? Can I , you know , whatever it is that you need , can I buy a new tool that's going to help me accelerate it ?

Speaker 1 25:53

Like the resources are another lever you can pull and so like , as you're having these tough conversations , I think you have to . You have to think about all those as you're proposing recommendations . So not just saying no , but saying maybe . But here's what I would suggest , like give me more time , Give me let me cut a little bit of scope here or give me more resources .

Speaker 1 26:15

And if all those things are are no like to your point , a resource is also , or time is also . Yeah , working extra hours , like sometimes it's we're working a weekend and that that sucks , but in reality that might be the only option where it's just like I think we gotta , I gotta have my team work this weekend . You know , morale is morale is going to take a hit , but if that's the only option , then if I'm talking to my boss , I'm like , hey , we're working the weekend , my team's not going to be thrilled about it , but that's the only way I can see us getting this done . Are you okay with that ? And like those are all the conversations I think you as a manager , especially if it's impacting your team have to have .

Speaker 2 26:49

Yeah , I just . You know , I know we're at time . You got to go Time . I'm just over it . I'm over it . I'm over all it . I do appreciate your advice , clark . As always , I think you do have the right approach and response . I just have to figure out how to work it into my life . Yeah Well , thanks . Thank you for being my therapist , clark , and I hope that our listeners .

Speaker 2 27:13

If you're in a situation similar to mine , you've got something out of this . We do have to run . It's a quickie this week , but it doesn't make it any less valuable . If you want to join in the conversation , do so by hitting the show notes , getting on our Discord , having a good time . Support the show by buying us a coffee . Listen to an ad , share the pod with your friends . Throw the podcast in your neighbor's doorstep , ring the doorbell , run away , do it . Do it now . If you're not doing it , then you don't love us . And if you don't love us , why are you listening to us ? Uh , thanks , as always , for for being a listener and being a friend . We appreciate you .

Speaker 1 27:47

I'm bruce and I'm clark we'll do the ai challenge next week , I promise we promise we'll do it .

Speaker 2 27:53

you're on'll do the AI challenge next week . I promise , we promise , we'll do it . You're on mute . We'll see you next week .