SPEAKER_01: 0:00

Good sign. Good sign. Feels like the ground dogs day. It it really does. And I I I don't know why. Uh but you know what I do know? Clark? Welcome back to Cover Strategy Podcast. I'm Bruce. And I'm Clark. And we have a very special guest with us today, who is joining us for the very first time on this pod. Very good friend of mine. Welcome to the show. Michael. Michael, would you mind uh introducing yourself and giving us a little background on who you are, where you're from, and what you do.

SPEAKER_00: 0:40

Thank you for having me. Well, uh, my name is I said that my my name is Michael. Uh I'm a marine engineer. I am from Denmark, so most of what I'm you know be talking about is uh based around uh how we run things in Denmark on ships and stuff like that. Uh I've been a marine engineer for 11 years now, close to love it.

SPEAKER_01: 1:04

And uh I do have to apologize to Michael because we actually, this is the second time we're recording this. We've had this entire set of conversation once before, and uh Craig and G-Arc are recording robots betrayed us. So thank you for putting up with us and being patient and doing this again. But the conversation was so good I don't mind having it twice because it was super interesting. So I I'm gonna kick us off with a question, which is why marine engineer?

SPEAKER_00: 1:36

Um well I started out as a mechanic, and then when I was uh starting to finish up uh my schooling for that, I realized I would I didn't want to be a mechanic for the rest of my life. So I started to look like what I could use my uh mechanic skills or my mechanical education other than a car mechanic, and um there wasn't a lot. And then I saw something called a motorman, uh which said it works on ships. And I quickly found out that uh Danish Danish seafarers do not work as uh motormen, so it was engineer, and then I said okay, then I will be an engineer. So I th I and I've I've when I read the like the what the education and the job specified, it sounded very interesting to me. So that's why I took uh and became a marine engineer.

SPEAKER_02: 2:34

That's awesome. Yeah, it's it's so funny, and we talked about this a little bit on the uh recording that we had uh to scrap, but you know, our main audience is mainly corporate professionals, you know, largely nine to five, a lot of those folks in the technology industry. So what you do is so almost otherworldly compared to what we do and what our day-to-days look like. Um and it's interesting because you know, you you actually had to go through, if I remember right, an apprenticeship where you kind of learned how to be a mechanic and you decided, you know, hey, is this not only did you learn a lot of skills, but um you actually were able to figure out if that's something you wanted to do. And is that what kind of guided you to say, hey, maybe being an actual mechanic isn't what I want to do because of what you learned as being an apprentice?

SPEAKER_00: 3:21

Uh it was more like the way the work was. Uh, it didn't feel like uh the work, the the salary was compensatory for for the work because we had like every day was um overtime, uh we felt like it was running to everything, and uh like there was um how to say uh you wear out your body doing it. So it I was like I I don't want to do this for the rest of my life, and like I remember like a lot of the people I went because the way it works is you have uh apprenticeship and then you have like schooling time, so it's like uh split up with uh uh working as an apprentice in a like in a shop, and then you go to school for like a month and then back to the shop and then school, and a lot of the people I went were in the school with, they said like they couldn't see themselves working long time uh as a mechanic either.

SPEAKER_01: 4:17

So did you Yeah, it is interesting, and you know something I just realized we didn't talk about last time. Was the first time you went on one of these large ships? That that was like your first day on the job, right? Like, did you ever get uh apprenticeship on the boat? I guess I can't call it a boat, on the ship itself, or was it just like, all right, you're on board, let's go, you're an engineer now.

SPEAKER_00: 4:42

No, uh so in order to you have you have to get a certificate uh to be an engineer. And in order to get the certificate, first you have to get your education, but then you need six months uh effective sailing time before you can get your certificate. Um what a lot of people do, uh because you can get become what is called a cadet, and then you when you're in school, you will have uh one internship at the beginning of the schooling, and then one at the end, and then you are like a cadet, and then you can get your saling time when you're doing that, and then as soon as you're finished with your education, you can actually sign on as an engineer.

SPEAKER_03: 5:23

Very interesting.

SPEAKER_04: 5:24

Yeah, that's super cool.

SPEAKER_02: 5:26

Oh well, I was wondering, okay, so I think you gave us a little bit of background um about your parents last time, and you know, uh I think I remember, was it your mom or your dad actually had some experience? Like maybe not as a marine engineer, but on these types of ships.

SPEAKER_00: 5:41

Yeah, my mom she was uh a waiter and she worked on uh the ferries between uh Denmark and uh England.

SPEAKER_02: 5:48

Got it. So it wasn't too unfamiliar to you of like what this type of job was, and what was it your first time on a boat or I guess a ship?

SPEAKER_00: 5:56

Uh no, I've been on ships before, uh but they like ferries, uh, but not like uh uh trend uh transport ships.

SPEAKER_02: 6:07

Yeah, okay, got it. So talk to us a little bit about um a day in the life, like paint us a picture for how how your job is, what it is that you do. And I know we said ship because it is a massive, massive ship. So you can help uh can you help us visualize like what that job looks like and what the a day-to-day might look like for you?

SPEAKER_00: 6:26

Yeah, so uh in the morning we will have uh a morning meeting, and not now I'm just talking uh specifically for the engine department. We will have a morning meeting, and uh as second engineer, it's my job to uh delegate the jobs for the day. So we have uh a maintenance system uh where every day it will give some jobs that have to be uh done today. A lot of them are like minor jobs, just checking equipment, like uh checking a pump, the pressure, and the amps and stuff like that from the end. So you have a list of the jobs, some of them are delegated to a specific person. Uh most of them are put on uh the second engineer, and then it's basically my job to delegate them out to uh to the other people. And then we make the plan. Um then there's some paperwork, have to fill out. We have uh what's called an uh engine room logbook. Uh you have to fill out every day. It's like all the we have to take um parameters of the main engine if it's running and stuff like that. And then we basically start uh the the work for the day, and then when we finish a job, we have to go into the we uh the system and sign off the job and write like what we found, uh, if we changed anything, stuff like that. And then it's a normal eight-hour day, I will say. Depending. It's very dependent. But like we have a normal eight-hour day, and then if I have the watch, then uh in the evening I have to take uh night rounds, check everything, it's okay, no problems. And then uh I have the alarm during the nighttime. So if there is a problem, I'll get the alarm in my cabin, uh and then I'll have to go down and solve it.

SPEAKER_04: 8:10

I don't know.

SPEAKER_02: 8:10

What is the first is your head just going in a straight? Like I don't know about you, but I'm like software development. I've got Jira, I'm going to my daily stand-up or signing out tasks. I'm picking up one of those tasks, I'm going through the day, I'm updating it after you know I get the work done or the progress that I've made, and then I'm signing off and doing it the same the next day. Is that what your head went?

SPEAKER_01: 8:31

No, it it it does. It's so funny hearing Michael talk about his sort of day-to-day, because for me, that sounds therapeutic. It sounds lovely, it almost sounds like a vacation, but it doesn't sound like work. Like it if I was trained and I was able to do this job, I feel like it'd be a lot of fun and it wouldn't be a lot of the rat race and the grind and the stress and the hassle of corporate, which we love so much in this pod. Am I wrong for saying that, Michael?

SPEAKER_00: 9:03

Uh no, most of the time, like uh you don't you don't get somebody uh after you uh with uh we have to finish this right now. It has to be finished, we have to finish it now. We don't really get that internally on the ship. It can come from like the company. They can be pushing a lot, but like internally not that much, depending on the equipment. We have something, uh we have certain equipment that is called critical equipment, and that has to be operational at all times. So if like if you're working on that one, then you have a little bit of a a push, but otherwise it's not there's not that much uh push, but then something big breaks down, and then uh then suddenly you are running.

SPEAKER_01: 9:49

Well, is okay, so what does a day look like?

SPEAKER_02: 9:52

Yeah, I always curious about the same thing. Like, what is a what is a tough day in in your life that you're like, oh this day was miserable for me?

SPEAKER_00: 10:01

Usually have to do with uh equipment breaks down. Uh and depending on on the type of equipment we're talking about, um I can give you an example. Uh when I was a third engineer, in the middle of the night time, I got an alarm on uh our boilers that uh and then I went down and I tried to solve it, and I tried to solve it, and it didn't work, and it didn't work, and it didn't work, and then I had to call like the chief engineer and say, like, I need assistance. And like I think worked all morning, still no problem. So we like everybody's tired. And then finally we find a problem. But like it's the whole day with this problem, and you're completely uh busted by the end of the day because you up the middle of the night and have to uh solve this problem because it was a problem we had to solve. It wasn't something we could say, okay, we'll just leave it for later.

SPEAKER_02: 11:03

I my head just goes to Bruce. You and I have both been through this many times. If like one of our critical systems is down there for the day, we're like, all right, we'll see you guys later. Like, I hope someone figures that out or it comes back up. Like, we have it so so cushy in our world compared to this.

SPEAKER_01: 11:20

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. It's uh a bad day does not sound good in in this environment.

SPEAKER_00: 11:27

Absolutely. One thing I will say is like after the day, then it's like, oh, that was actually interesting. It was or fun uh to figure out, but like when you're in the shit, then it's like oh fucking this sucked, this sucks, this sucks so much. And then afterwards, you're like, oh, that actually was it was interesting uh to find out the what the problem was.

SPEAKER_02: 11:50

Yeah. Yeah, I think in our world, unlike yours, you know, if something goes down, it's not usually not the end of the world, and a lot of the times you can't do anything about it. In your world, it's a little more mission critical because if something's not functioning, the whole ship isn't moving. And yeah, it's it's very, very mission critical. I think the nice thing that um came to mind for me, you guys have a lot of autonomy in how you do your work because the team is kind of tight. So you you kind of meet to plan out your work, but then you just use your skill and your mastery to go get the work done. And it's nice because no one is necessarily like over your back, like in our world, like a scrum master would be over your back and be like, hey, is this task done yet? Like, is there any update here? And like you don't have any of that, which is really, really nice. So you don't have a project manager who's kind of holding you accountable to that. Of course, you know, you mentioned you have kind of the people who run the ships that might be doing a little bit of that, but they can't do what you're doing.

SPEAKER_00: 12:45

No, like so it's actually my job to be be that guy uh with the other guys, but uh I'm I'm pretty like as long as they do the job properly, I don't really care how much how long it takes. Uh and the the most big push we get is from the uh the head office uh with uh stuff uh they want to know or uh want an update or something.

SPEAKER_01: 13:15

So okay, that's that that's something that uh I want to kind of revisit that we talked about last time. You get updates, but the internet connectivity, the Wi-Fi on board is not what Clark and I are dealing with every day. So, how do comms work? And what about outbound communications, inbound, you know, surfing Reddit? What what is that like on a big ship?

SPEAKER_00: 13:41

So uh actually we uh was it last year? We got Starlink, so that was pretty nice. Uh it's pretty fast. But so like you have um like the company internet and then you have your private internet, so the company internet is fast enough so you can send email and stuff like that, and uh yeah, that's pretty much it. And you can surf like the internet and search for things on Google, and that's about it. And then private with uh Starlink, so you have limited uh gigabytes uh per week you can use.

SPEAKER_03: 14:20

And and it's it's also interesting too, kind of building on that.

SPEAKER_02: 14:24

It's not something like for your job, for our jobs, like if we run into a problem, we Google search it, or now we use AI and be like, hey, you know, help me solve this issue. Here's like the parameters around it, and especially with coding and development, it's easier than ever to find solutions to your problems. But for you, you don't have that resource. So you have, I think you talked about last time we were talking, you have a manual, maybe, uh, but a lot of it is just kind of on you to troubleshoot and figure out. And if you can't figure out, you have maybe just one or two people you've got to work with to hopefully find somebody who can help figure it out, or you guys just pound your head against it all night and help you fix it.

SPEAKER_00: 15:02

Yeah, like I I will say the manuals we have are pretty good at uh uh if you read through them, then they will give you a lot of lot of help. Uh but it requires that you read through them, uh, which is not everybody who likes to do that.

SPEAKER_02: 15:21

I don't remember the last time I actually read through a manual, and my because I just have instant gratification and availability of all information, I am so lazy now. Like if I get a 20-page manual, I'm probably like taking a picture, sending it to ChatGPT and being like, hey, tell me where I can find the issue for this. I'm so lazy, it's so bad. Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_01: 15:42

I y'all, you're nuts because if I buy a new product that actually comes with a manual, I'm jumping for joy. Because it's not like scan this QR code and set this thing up. It's ooh, paper instructions that I know are gonna take me through this entire process because they have to, as opposed to a link to something that has been updated because the product is you know shady. I'll I love I love me a good manual. Where do you where do you fall on that scale, Michael? Do you do you read the manual or you can do that?

SPEAKER_00: 16:10

I read the manual. I read the manual every time. Like I remember like the when I got the new ship, um they had a lot of manuals for physical, and then they had a lot of the manuals who were digital uh on the hard drive. And I had to do a job on a piece of equipment, and then I I just took uh the digital manual and I was looking, and then I was after the dismantled apart, I was looking, this doesn't look like the manual. So I was running to the manual and I was looking, okay. I was looking out on the equipment. It's not that it doesn't look the same, and I was look I was going more and more crazy, and then finally I said, Okay, now I'm taking the physical manual. Then I found out the digital manual we had was uh for a different uh different model. So I should just have written the hard uh hard uh manual to begin with. Yep.

SPEAKER_02: 17:02

Wow, yeah, always read the manual. I feel so I kind of feel dirty for what I just said out loud in the public. Now everybody knows how lazy I am when it comes to manuals. And maybe I need to get better. I'll go back to my roots.

SPEAKER_00: 17:16

Yeah, but like like a lot of the when we dismantle equipment, it it is uh you have to do it in a certain order, or it's when you're tightening, it has to be a talk, or you risk uh destroying uh equipment. So it's it's important you know uh how to uh how to dismantle and assemble the equipment.

SPEAKER_02: 17:35

Yeah. Yeah, it's uh something that I think is interesting to people too, that we talked about last time is how is your employment different? So, you know, for us, we you know, maybe get a contract, you know, contact a job six months to a year, or you just have a permanent job that you work nine to five, you get your normal holidays and vacation time. What does your employment look like um as a marine engineer?

SPEAKER_00: 18:00

Uh so this is just for for day and seafarers. We have a uh a contract with the the company, and that one runs uh until you let you uh quit or they fire you. Um and then uh every time you sign onto the ship, you sign a specific contract for the duration of the that stay.

SPEAKER_02: 18:26

Got it. So you kind of have this period of time that you know you're going to be working. And but for you, I think it's not it's not like every day you're on this ship, it's just for that contracted period, right? And then you kind of have a break after after that contract is over.

SPEAKER_00: 18:41

Yeah, so the for Danish E first, the the contract is what we call uh one-to-one. So uh yeah, every one day on board you earn one free day uh ashore, and then you are like it's two months, and then uh you have two months off. Two months, ten, ten weeks. It depends uh how it's set up and the agreement you have with your reliever.

SPEAKER_02: 19:06

Love that. Yeah, that's really nice. So effectively you end up working, you know, these periods of two months or ten weeks or whatever it is, but it's it's like half the year. So half the year you're working, half the year you're not.

SPEAKER_00: 19:15

Yeah, although it can be uh, I will say, with that's uh truth with with modifications, because like you can have one year where you have like uh eight months on board, and then you can have one year where you have uh five or five or four months on board. It depends like whatever happens. Usually, in my experience, it's never four weeks on board or four months on board, it's always uh eight months on board or something like that in a year.

SPEAKER_01: 19:46

And you're not you mentioned in the beginning that you you do your eight hours of work a day, and then if you're on call, you might get that little red light at night. But what is the what is the downtime on the ship look like?

SPEAKER_00: 20:00

Uh so it's actually regulated uh downtime downtime, uh, because we have uh rest hours we need to uh we need to keep up with. Uh so it is in a 24 period, you need uh is it uh ten hours of rest where six hours has to be in a continuous uh period. So and um but like normally we say uh we do eight hours of work and then uh if you get uh have a maneuvering where you have to go to port or there's uh something specific, then you have to try and plan for uh your re your work hours according to that you will be up that time.

SPEAKER_02: 20:51

It's almost like a pilot or something like that. It's almost like you only can have so much air time before it could get dangerous, you know, if if you are you know getting sleepy or you know, if you're not operating at the highest capacity, because it could be dangerous, you know, if you're operating that way for yourself and also for the people that are around you.

SPEAKER_00: 21:12

Yeah. Uh and that's why because the rest hours that's regulated by by law. So you have to uh you can like deviate from it if for a short time or stuff like that, if something happens, but like uh you will be checked on the your rest hours, and if they are uh in the red, because we have to fill them out every day, the your rest hours. Uh and if they are not in compliance, then uh you will get a fine and the company will get a fine.

SPEAKER_02: 21:41

Can somebody rest hours for me? Because I think my email gets much, much worse at the end of the day or late at night when I probably shouldn't be emailing and I'm emailing. Someone needs to regulate my hours. I want to log my sleep and rest hours to make sure that somebody holds me accountable.

SPEAKER_01: 21:58

I love that. That's great. Um, are you allowed to like run up and down the ship? You know, if you want to take a jog, you running around the the top of the what is it, the the deck? Are you running on the deck or like what what what are the rules for ship exploration?

SPEAKER_00: 22:14

Uh you can go wherever you want. Uh there's depending on where you are. Uh so we have something called enclosed spaces. Uh and they're different categories. Uh and there you need to to advise people uh where gas detectors and stuff like that. So there's like limits, but uh otherwise you can go wherever you want.

SPEAKER_03: 22:38

Love that. Yeah, that's great.

SPEAKER_02: 22:40

I I know one thing that a lot of people will be curious about. You know, what's your favorite part of the job? What's your least favorite part of your job?

SPEAKER_00: 22:50

Uh exactly the same thing. I like I love the the the problems and the way we have to solve them. And I hate it hate uh the problems and the way we have to solve them. Uh because when you're in the shit it can be it can be really the shit. Uh but then afterwards you you you uh it's it's interesting and you get some good stories out of it and stuff like that.

SPEAKER_01: 23:19

And you work on a very uh sort of multicultural crew, right? And you know, obviously you're from Denmark, but you speak English. What is the uh what is the natural language of the ship and what is the makeup of your co-workers?

SPEAKER_00: 23:33

So most ships will have a working language though of English. Um the make of the ship is uh a mix between uh European crew, uh Danish, Swedish, uh Eastern European, and then uh Filipinos. For for the company I I was I'm in. Uh otherwise a lot of there's a lot of Indians, uh Eastern Europeans, uh Filipinos generally speaking. Uh I have heard that uh the Chinese are starting to come in, but I don't know how much. Uh I don't have any experience with them.

SPEAKER_01: 24:11

And they all have to speak English on board.

SPEAKER_03: 24:14

Yeah. Very interesting.

SPEAKER_02: 24:19

One thing um I'm curious about, you know, we all have kind of our work horror stories or hazards of the job or things that um make the job unique in a lot of ways. I think you you have a couple scenarios, you know, given you're you know on a ship with people's lives at stake, and you know, you're responsible for a lot of things. What is kind of the the scariest part of the job for you?

SPEAKER_00: 24:45

Uh I want to say there shouldn't be any parts of the job that's scary. Uh because you should prepare everything uh when you do a job so uh there's no risk uh associated with it. But like the weather is uh it will do its own thing, so you always have to uh keep that in count. Then I hate heights. I absolutely so uh heights is gonna be a big one for me.

SPEAKER_01: 25:21

Does does that actually impact you in any way when you're on the ship? Like if you look over the the I don't know what the word it the railing on the deck and you're like oh the ocean's kind of far, I'd rather not see that right now.

SPEAKER_00: 25:35

No, mostly it's because if you have to uh go up the mast to do repairs or something like that. Yeah. So I usually uh delegate that to somebody else.

SPEAKER_02: 25:46

That's the way to do it. Hey, I'm gonna delegate it to this guy because I do not want to go up there. I love that. I love that. That's awesome. One thing we talk about a lot is is corporate ladder. Like for us, you know, it's kind of climbing the corporate ladder and getting to that next role. And you know, it's sometimes in our world, unfortunately, like very gray. Like what I need to do, what skills I need to learn, what things I need to do in order to get a promotion or climb the ladder. What does it look like for you from like a growth perspective?

SPEAKER_00: 26:20

So um basically, if you're a marine engineer, you start as a junior engineer, that's either a fourth or third engineer, and then to be able to be promoted, you actually need to uh it's uh you have to have uh what's called sale time, uh so effective sales time. Uh I think it's uh one year effective. Uh then you can get the certificate for the next rank up, and it's like this. Um the maximum you can be on board as a chief engineer. And the getting the promotion is uh if you're going for chief engineer or junior engineer to uh second engineer, it's usually just recommendations from uh the crew you've been sailing with, and then uh it's pretty pretty straightforward. Then uh it takes a lot, it takes a more to from uh second engineer to chief engineer to keep get promoted. Uh of course you need to get the recommendation from the uh crew you've been sailing with, um and then uh the office has to uh approve you.

SPEAKER_03: 27:34

Got it.

SPEAKER_02: 27:34

So make sure experience plus you know that list you have to go through, make sure you're kind of meeting all the qualifications, and then there is kind of somebody who has to approve it at the end of the day.

SPEAKER_01: 27:45

Yeah. So and and that's that's curious to me too, because I know that there's a uh you know, we uh when you get higher up in the ranks, you're on the ship longer, correct? Right? Like your your lower level staff, they're swapping out and you're not seeing them over and over again. But the higher level staff, you might see them multiple times.

SPEAKER_00: 28:07

Is that right? Uh yeah, but uh actually the lower level staff, because they usually feel Pinos, they have a longer contract with us, but uh the uh you won't be on the same ship all the time. Uh but they would they would pref they the companies generally prefer that they have what's called top four, which is uh second engineer, chief engineer, chief officer, and captain. They would like them to stay on the same ship for for a period of time, like two, three years, where you are you are still you're not going home, but for that period of time you will be on the same ship, you'll go back to the same ship. And they will like they like that because then you know the ship, so you can solve the problems that are, and you have like you ownership, if you understand what I mean, over the ship. So you don't just like okay, just have to to stay until uh this just needs to hold until I go home, and then uh it's not my problem anymore. Which I I have seen a lot with the the the people who uh who just change ships every time, then when they get to the end of the contract, it's like okay, now I just need to this needs just need to hold until I uh leave, and then uh it's not my problem anymore.

SPEAKER_01: 29:19

That uh that hits a little close to home because I think uh Clark and I have been in that same exact situation in corporate jobs, just get this over the line, and then it's someone else's problem. So good to know some things never change.

SPEAKER_02: 29:35

Oh man. Yeah, it's it's true. What's um I'm curious, Michael, what is something that the average person might not know about you know what you do, or maybe being on a on a boat, like it that you think is just not common knowledge? Because I think we can all kind of conceptualize it. I don't think we have the right words and all that, but what's like something unique that might be surprising to?

SPEAKER_03: 30:04

Probably uh lack of sleep.

SPEAKER_00: 30:10

Uh because or the way the the sea is sometimes you can have like a period of time where you won't sleep or won't get proper sleep for for a couple of days. Really? Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 30:22

Do you get do you get seasick?

SPEAKER_00: 30:25

I get uh when I just come on board if we go straight into like a storm or something, then I get uh a little seasick. Uh but after that I'm used to it.

SPEAKER_02: 30:35

Wow. Oh man, that's terrible. Yeah, I I've never been seasick, but I get vertigo occasionally with my cushy job and staying at home. And I think I think that's bad. I can't even imagine, you know, being in a bad storm on a ship of that size. How long have you been a marine engineer?

SPEAKER_00: 30:54

Uh 11 years. 11 years.

SPEAKER_02: 30:57

Gotcha. And is that something you think like is is that uh the rest of your life you want to keep that as your career path? You don't anticipate changing anything?

SPEAKER_00: 31:06

No, I I don't think I uh I I like the the way uh everything is set up too much, like the fact that when I'm home, I'm home. I don't have to think about uh work. That uh that's uh I don't think I can uh go back to uh or try a regular job again.

SPEAKER_01: 31:26

Yeah so hypothetical for you, you listen to the podcast, you know what Clark and I do. If you were offered a 30% raise, would you take one of our jobs or keep your current job?

SPEAKER_00: 31:39

I would keep my current job.

SPEAKER_02: 31:43

Wow. Okay, I love it. Raise the stakes, raise the stakes 50% raise.

SPEAKER_00: 31:52

Nah, I'm glad. Still can't.

SPEAKER_01: 31:57

I love that answer so much because I would probably take a 50% pay cut if I was as smart as you and could do your job.

SPEAKER_02: 32:05

I was gonna do the same thing. I'm like, yeah, you know what? I would I would happily do that job for for less money, I think. I think I won't know until I do it, but I think.

SPEAKER_01: 32:15

One thing we didn't talk about this time, we we did on the the failed recording, Clark, is people on the boat fish. And I know once you heard that, uh you were sold on the on the job and the the the potential career path of it. What else do folks do on the boat for Fun Michael?

SPEAKER_00: 32:32

Yeah. Well we have we have uh the company has to uh every month they have to put a certain amount into an account that's called like the welfare count account. Uh for the ship screw they can use money. So sometimes uh we buy prices for bingo. Uh uh there is a gym on board uh that I like I play a lot of video games, so uh I play uh play video games.

SPEAKER_03: 33:03

Uh love it. And you're you're on a gaming laptop, right? Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 33:11

Yeah. Yeah, I was gonna say you probably don't stream games though, right? You probably have to download them and then you just play them probably local.

SPEAKER_00: 33:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 33:22

Yeah. That's still super cool though. So a lot of the conveniences of like home are available because you have the gym, you can you know go up and to the top of the ship, people can fish, uh, you have a gaming laptop, so like there are some conveniences. It's not like you're just in a a metal box with a cot at night. It's actually pretty comfortable, it sounds like.

SPEAKER_04: 33:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 33:45

Uh you have to get used to it. Like that there's more noise than you you will have in the uh usual uh home.

SPEAKER_02: 33:52

Yeah. Do you have like temperature regulation in your rooms?

SPEAKER_00: 33:56

Uh depending on the ship, but you uh all ships have uh air con systems uh and heating systems. It depends because some s some ships they have like where you can control uh in every cabin, although others it's like uh everybody gets the same temperature.

SPEAKER_02: 34:13

What is what is uh like lunchtime or dinner time look like? Like is it a whole a whole crew endeavor that you guys you know all are able to you know enjoy lunch at the same time or have a cafeteria room service, maybe?

SPEAKER_00: 34:27

Uh no room service. Uh but uh we have we have uh a mess room. Uh depending on the ship, it can be split up between officer mess and crew mess, or it can be everybody together. And uh all the ships they have a uh uh cook who uh who makes the food for us.

SPEAKER_03: 34:47

That's nice.

SPEAKER_02: 34:48

Yeah, that is nice. Is is the food really good? Or would you say it's eh, you know, it's alright? Maybe school cafeteria level.

SPEAKER_00: 34:57

Very, very dependent on the cook. I have had some really bad cooks and some really good cooks, so it is super dependent on the cook you get.

SPEAKER_02: 35:07

I feel like that would be my contract question. Who's the chef on the ship? Will I take this contract or not?

SPEAKER_01: 35:15

Well, so what happens if someone gets sick? And I, you know, do do people get like airborne viruses when you're all confined to a ship for weeks on end? Does that actually happen?

SPEAKER_00: 35:26

It has happened, it's not that often because uh uh depending where you are, you don't have that much much interaction with uh people from not on a ship. But like I have been sick before. Uh I remember one time uh we went RIDOC, and me and the chief engineer both got COVID. So we uh we were sent to a hotel, so I got to spend uh two weeks in a hotel in uh Rika Latvia, it was super super fun.

SPEAKER_01: 35:55

That's a that is an interesting outcome for that scenario. So it does happen, which is which is strange. If if someone gets injured or sick on board, I'm guessing there's uh a medical person that can help you out.

SPEAKER_00: 36:06

Uh no. Uh there's uh the tech officers have uh um training and medical help, and then uh there is something called uh radio medical, which is uh you pick up the phone and you call, and you in when they ship it's uh you call a hospital in Denmark, and there is a doctor who will uh talk you through what you need, and we have medicine on board, uh and we can only give out the medicine after talking with the doctor. Uh and then uh depending on how bad it is, uh we may have to divert to get people uh ashore.

SPEAKER_02: 36:47

Wow. Interesting. I I thought there had to be a medic. I was probably right there with you, Bruce. I'm like, how do you go on a ship for that long and not have someone who's like a medic or medically trained at least?

SPEAKER_01: 36:59

I mean, I'm dropping a wrench on my big toe. I'm just telling you right now, it my big toe is gonna be swollen, the fingernail is gonna turn black. You already know me. This is gonna happen.

SPEAKER_02: 37:10

I think Michael would probably tell you, yeah, suck it up. You gotta get to work. Get your task done. Yeah, pretty much. Well, in hearing what we do, what's the thing that you're like, that's that sounds terrible. Is it just having to just constantly be on all the time and not really being able to step away?

SPEAKER_00: 37:31

Yeah, 100% that. Like uh I remember I had a sale with a guy, and he told he had a friend who was uh who used to sail, but then he started working ashore, and he told me that he was at a party with him, and like his friend spent all the party in the corner on his phone with his laptop. And that sounds like the worst way to spend my life.

SPEAKER_02: 37:55

I love that. Yeah, I love that. It does sound it sounds awful. I'm so happy I'm not doing that from time to time.

SPEAKER_01: 38:06

Uh okay, so important question because this this is real and this happens. We've talked about this before, but tell us about the pirate situation.

SPEAKER_00: 38:15

Yeah. Um well we have, I think there's three places with pirates. Like we have West Africa, then you have East Africa near Somalia, and then you have the Malaga Strait, I think. Uh and I've been mostly on West Africa. Uh when I was down in West Africa, a lot a lot uh they were just shifting from uh only robbing you to also kidnapping you. So uh that was fun.

SPEAKER_01: 38:44

That's terrifying.

SPEAKER_03: 38:45

That is absolutely terrifying.

SPEAKER_01: 38:48

Yeah. Don't like that. Um so you're you're obviously trained and you have a a protocol around if something like that happens. What is the what is the setup process if you hear there are pirates in the area?

SPEAKER_00: 39:04

So before we enter uh what's called a high risk area, we do uh what's called ship hardening. And that means we are racer wire all around the ship, uh on the railings. So uh they we are the least tempting target. Um and then if you are attacked, then there is you have a a button on board, when you press that one, it goes straight to the for the Danish ship, it's straight for the Danish Navy, which tells them this ship is under attack now. And then everybody goes down to what we call the sit still. It's a sh it's a uh room that we can lock, uh keep safe, and then we can uh somewhat control the ship from there, and then we have radios down there and water, so we can stay there for a bit.

SPEAKER_01: 39:53

Love that. I mean it seems like you really thought through, and and the the folks on the ship, your security has really thought through this process. So I'm glad there is safety and comfort uh in that situation. What about a weather event? Like if you're in a really bad storm, what do you do?

SPEAKER_00: 40:10

Stuck it up and hope uh hope everything works.

SPEAKER_01: 40:13

Uh this answer is being thrown out too much on this. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 40:19

Uh there's just nothing like I've been in some pretty sh pretty bad storms, and like if you get into it, you're just in it. Like because you can sail fast, so you you just have to weather the storm. There's nothing like you can sail from it or something. Uh so just have to uh suck it up.

SPEAKER_01: 40:36

Yeah. I get it though. It's it's the one thing you can't control.

SPEAKER_03: 40:41

Yeah. Oh my goodness. Well, any any closing questions from you, Clark?

SPEAKER_02: 40:53

I think I'm all good. Michael, it was an absolute pleasure to have you on. Not once, but twice. First in the unreleased episode and second in the real episode that's going to go out now that we got the G-Arc and Craig thing figured out. So thank you so much for coming on again, just to go through this and just you know entertain our questions. My brain was just spinning last time after we had our conversation. So I got a chance to ask even more questions this time, and I really appreciate it.

SPEAKER_01: 41:21

This is by far the better recording. Of course, thank you. Thank you. And this is by far the better recording. So uh, you know what? It all works out in the end. So thank you. I also have to uh sadly inform our listeners that we did force Michael to play uh Is It AI? And I I'm I am happy to report that both Michael and I guessed the correct water cooler. So even though he's on a ship, he knows what a corporate water cooler looks like and he knows what an AI looks like. So props to Michael for getting it right and uh apologies for for missing out on the fun of that last time. Hey, and if you want to play uh Is It AI, you can join our Discord. And you can do that by going into your show notes, clicking the the link tree in there. You can you can give us a uh shout out on the various platforms that we're on. If you want to give us a review, we'd appreciate that. But more importantly, if you want to join the Discord, just click join the Discord. You can buy us a coffee and support the show. Another thing we mentioned on the lost recording is the fact that we had a couple of coffees bought for us from some very nice people, one of which is a guest on this very pod today. So apologies for not giving you the shout-out for for giving us that uh that support on the show. We were also supported by, uh, and this is true, quote, NordVPN. So thank you to whomever you are that used NordVPN as the sponsor through Buy Us a Coffee. You're very clever. We appreciate the joke. Unless you actually are NordVPN, in which case I guess we're sponsored now, so thank you. But uh you can buy us a coffee and support the show. It is a completely host-funded program, except for those coffees that you buy us. So thank you for that. And if you'd like to purchase some swag, you can do that on the link tree as well. And am I missing anything, Clark? Do we cover it?

SPEAKER_02: 43:14

No, I think you got it. Like, share, subscribe. And if you want to ask more questions to Michael, you can come to the Discord and ask. I'm sure he'd be happy to you know relay how miserable our lives are compared to his.

SPEAKER_00: 43:27

Yeah, I'm uh more than happy to answer any questions.

SPEAKER_01: 43:30

That's right. If you have questions, Michael is in our Discord. Feel free to drop them in that corporate strategy channel, and he will be happy to answer them for you. Thank you again for joining us today. Super, super appreciative of taking two hours of your time now for the pod. And uh, I would love to have you back again in the future to hear more stories of adventure and seafaring expeditions. So thanks again, Michael.

SPEAKER_00: 43:56

Yeah, thanks for having me. And I would be happy to come on again.

SPEAKER_01: 44:00

And we'd love to have you. Uh and that does it for another episode. Uh, as always, thanks to our listeners for for tuning in. Do check out that link tree and do all the things we just said beforehand. Uh, and if we don't get you, until the next time, I'm Bruce. And I'm Clark.

SPEAKER_03: 44:18

And you're on mute. We will see you next week.